Covering City Council and Sundry, with flair. Those individuals can still have a bail set. This service should only be used to report non-emergencies and non-violent crimes with no suspect information or leads, which occurred within the unincorporated County of Boulder or within the limits of the Town of Superior or Town of Lyons. Not everybody belongs in jail. It's a far larger responsibility than municipal policing because we run the county jail, which currently houses about 420 people. Johnson: After a significant policy change in the jail, the second incident of tasing someone at the restraint chair occurred and that was outside of policy and was addressed quickly. It wasnt a wildfire. . An old friend and progressive activist who has decades of experience in the county gave me some insight. Do we need to build another shelter? Were about to break ground on the alternative sentencing facilities. Im still hoping to win, he said. Hayes: The system is simply failing. What would your approach be to reducing recidivism? Please click on the box below to learn about what the Boulder County Sheriffs Office is doing regarding equity. I retired from the police department and went to work for the sheriff's office. I would certainly continue all the programs that are in the jail. KGNU is made possible by listeners like you! On today's edition of A Public Affair, we will broadcast an online candidate forum that was held for the primary candidates running for Boulder County Sheriff. The Boulder Chamber hosted a candidate debate on Thursday between the Democratic primary frontrunners for Boulder County Sheriff, Curtis Johnson and David Hayes. Ken Wilson, former Boulder City Council member Elaina Shively is supported by the other two commissioners, Marta Loachamin and Claire Levy. What can we do to move people out of the jail system?. He rejoined the Louisville department in 2014 as police chief, a move that Hayes argues makes him uniquely qualified to serve as sheriff because hes the only candidate with experience working as a police chief in Boulder County. One-on-one and in a group setting and we talked about why we were making a policy change and what the expectations were. Were in the process of improving it. This news doesnt write itself. Johnson says he was at the Boulder Police Department when the student died and that there has been a significant policy change on tasering recently. Never in my wildest imagination did I think my home in suburban Louisville would burn to the ground from a wildfire. Email your thoughts to boulderbeatnews@gmail.com, Want more stories like this, delivered straight to your inbox? I think what you'll see is that I'm a proven leader with proven accomplishments throughout my career, both at Boulder and at Louisville. Update: According to unofficial results posted by the Boulder County Clerk and Recorders office at 12:58 a.m., Curtis Johnson had 70.77% of the vote with 30,787 votes, and Dave Hayes had 29.23% of the vote with 12, 714 votes. By and large they're good men, good women working in the department. I established a values-based guidance system: Investigate beyond the obvious; leave things better than we found them; and we dont care about race, gender, sexual preference, certainly dont care about immigration status.. Boulder, CO 80301 Division Chief, Platform/priorities Whats more complicated now is the state of the economy, the state of housing. */ We also know that we have too many cars and not enough roads. The Moving can be an exciting experience. Boulder County has gone through several devastating natural disasters in recent years. It was an incredible mistreatment of an individual. Early Intervention and Prevention Services, First-Time Parents (Nurse-Family Partnership), Help for Someone Abusing Drugs or Alcohol, Tobacco Education & Prevention Partnership, Hazardous Materials Management Facility (HMMF), Office of Sustainability, Climate Action & Resilience (OSCAR), Short-Term Dwelling and Vacation Rental Licensing, Apply for a position within the Sheriffs Office, Restorative Justice Community Representative, If a position you are interested in is not posted at this time, please complete a, POST certified applicants from another state can apply for a provisional certificate. Ballots must be received by 7 p.m. on election . Clint Folsom, Mayor of Superior Website URL:HayesforBoulderCountySheriff.com, Family: Two daughters, Courtney and Amanda. Boulder, Conejos, Costilla, Delta, Denver, Douglas, Elbert, Huerfano, . Were in this pickle. Some are serious repeat offenders. Copyright 2023. Lawbreakers are not being held accountable due to limited jail space. Having just looked at the most recent use of force data for the jail, I can tell you that taser use in the jail, following the policy change and following the incident where the employee was terminated and prosecuted, has dropped dramatically, which is a good thing. Johnson, a division chief with the Boulder County Sheriffs Office, extended his lead over Louisville police Chief David Hayes to more than 20,000 votes after the latest results were released by the Boulder County Clerk and Recorders Office on Wednesday. Im not sure how strong a role law enforcement should play in that. Colorado is in a golden moment for gun law reform. Michael Doughtery, Boulder County District Attorney We understand there's not enough funding. And what are we going to do differently? Boulder, CO - Rex Laceby is publicly announcing his candidacy for Boulder County Sheriff. David Hayes, left, and Curtis Johnson are vying for Boulder County Sheriff in the Democratic primary. Would you advocate for ticketing people living on county land or in their cars on county streets? The jail, as it stands today, already has a large number of programs designed to help reduce recidivism. Ashley Stolzmann, mayor of Louisville (candidate for Boulder County Commissioner) BOULDER COUNTY Today, Boulder County District Attorney Michael Dougherty announced his endorsement for Curtis Johnson's bid to be the next sheriff in Boulder County. I remain committed to public safety and service and I also want to thank all of you for your continued support.. But 2022 marks the first election since the Colorado Independent Redistricting Commissions in 2021 redrew political maps across the state and broke up . I am still not sure how I will vote. A lot have been hampered by the pandemic; for example, pre-trial supervision. I am committed to pursuing the changes needed to protect our community in the event of future disasters.. The other day, we contacted an individual that was intoxicated in front of a business, just laying on the ground I think he had 14 warrants. That employee was reported by other employees as having done it, which is a positive for the culture, that theyre willing to hold their peers accountable. With this said, I am also a firm believer that only those individuals who present an articulable risk to the community or individual victims, or those with a history of failure to appear, should be subject to pre-trial incarceration. They were. email Your tax exempt donation benefits Boulder County law enforcement members who become seriously injured or killed in the line-of-duty. The next batch of unofficial results is expected to be released at 12:30 a.m. Wednesday. (function($) {window.fnames = new Array(); window.ftypes = new Array();fnames[0]='EMAIL';ftypes[0]='email';fnames[1]='MMERGE1';ftypes[1]='text';fnames[2]='MMERGE2';ftypes[2]='text';}(jQuery));var $mcj = jQuery.noConflict(true); Curtis Johnson has won the Democratic nomination for Boulder County sheriff, and, barring a surprise entry in the general election, will be the first new sheriff for the county in 20 years. In centuries past, cities with wooden buildings burned down frequently. Shively is director for the Center for Prevention and Restorative Justice at the Boulder County District Attorneys office. I work with state legislature now. 5600 Flatiron Parkway (Courtesy photos) By Mitchell Byars |. Hayes, who grew up in Denver, joined the Louisville Police Department 42 years ago but later moved to Boulder where he spent time working as a hostage negotiator for Boulders SWAT team. There may be some who like the idea of a small town mayor like (Stolzmann) on the commission, and maybe others (like me) who like that (Shively) has a track record of working on progressive efforts within the county, and who possibly she has the ability to work well with a county staff that has had a lot of turnover., With regard to the sheriffs race, she said, I think that (Hayes) shot himself in the foot at the NAACP forum by uttering all lives matter and resisting community ideas about policing. Karen Breslin Breslin for US Senate 2 minute Dan Chapin Dan Chapin County Assembly video When Dave is elected, Rex will seek any position in the Sheriffs department that allows him to affectively serve the community and offer his unique perspectives, vast leadership experience, Wildland Firefighting background and attributes that only a non-police officer can offer. Its going to take 18 months to two years to clear up the backlog in the courts. I see that (Johnson) publicly endorsed state legislation to require police communication to be unencrypted, and (Hayes) opposed it. David Hayes and Curtis Johnson "Meet the Candidates - Boulder County Sheriff Election" 06/03/22. Professional background: Chief of police in Louisville, 2014-present, Political/community experience: Served Boulder County communities since June of 1977, Vice President Colorado Association of Chiefs of Police, member of Boulder Chapter NAACP, member of Democratic Women of Boulder County, Education:B.S. What I will figure out as the sheriff is what's the better way to do this. Hayes: One of the first things I did becoming chief in Louisville, we established a value-based management system. Johnson: I think we need to do more and better work about addressing the unhoused population in Boulder County. We agreed that progressives are divided. These individuals, then they move to Larimer County. Those individuals can still have a bail set. BOULDER COUNTY, CO The state primary is June 30, and thousands of ballots have already been returned by drop box and mail in Boulder County. Boulder Beat. Were currently close to 64%. Both of the sheriff candidates lost their homes in the fire. email Johnson served in numerous roles in his almost 30 years with the Boulder Police Department before joining the sheriffs office in 2021 as the division chief overseeing support service. And we do have to get a handle on crime. More: johnsonforboco.com/priorities, Boulder Police Department, 1978-2014 Heres what to expect. So it is a balancing act and it's a balancing act every day. Pelle recruited retired Boulder Police Deputy Chief Curtis Johnson to the sheriff's department last year, where he is currently division chief, and has endorsed Johnson as his successor. Claire Levy, Boulder County Commissioner About eight years ago, I left as a deputy chief in Boulder and became the chief of police in Louisville. The Boulder County Sheriff's Office is managed by Sheriff Curtis Johnson, who is assisted by an Administrative Assistant and an Executive Staff comprised of Division Chiefs and managers who are responsible for the day to day running of the following divisions. The Boulder County Sheriff's Office is seeking qualified patrol candidates. Oftentimes jail is not the best setting for people to get those needs addressed.Despite all the resources we put into trying to help people, its still a jail, at the end of the day. Bob Yates, Boulder City Council Addressing mental illness in the criminal justice system Were not always the best resource. The Everbridge system also requires that you be at home, or that you have your phone, or that you've registered and it just didn't work as well as it possibly could have. The Boulder County Injured & Fallen Officer Fund is a Colorado 501(c)(3), tax-exempt, charitable organization. We have to figure out something else.. I worked in Boulder for 27 years. They were indicted and convicted for manslaughter. Alternate: 303-441-4444 So gun safety right now is a bit on my mind, given the threats to their safety just doing their jobs. As you may know, both (Johnson) and I lost our homes in Louisville due to the Marshall fire. Certainly equity's at the top of our list. The current sheriff, Joe Pelle, is not running for reelection after 20 years as sheriff. Those incidents, although few, if you want to count them on one hand what they would suggest is it's time for a culture change and there needs to be some kind of reset. 5600 Flatiron Parkway Hiring and retention Im not eager to advance another. (Courtesy photos) As of the 8:30 p.m. update from the Boulder County Clerk and Recorder's Office, Johnson. What (the tasing incidents) suggest to me is that there needs to be some cultural adjustment in the sheriff's office. Louisville Police Chief David Hayes advocates a "culture shift" in the department. Through his career, Johnson argues hes done just that. Or mail cash/check/precious gemstones toP.O. Theyre living out of their car. The other thing we can do is a transport car to take defendants who have warrants in other communities there. That means food, lodging, training. These individuals, then they move to Larimer County. Joe Pelle (2003-2023) George E. Epp (1990-2003) Brad Leach (1970-1990) Marvin D. Nelson (1966-1970) Arthur T. Everson (1942-1966) George A. Richart (1932-1942) Robert V. Blum (1922-1932) Robert L. Euler (1916-1922) In an interview in New York Magazine, climate scientist Daniel Swain said the Marshall Fire was something unique and horrifying. 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Not a lot of great stuff has come out of the response to homelessness in Boulder. With no Republican challenger, it is likely Johnson will run unopposed in November to succeed Sheriff Joe Pelle, who is term-limited after 20 years as sheriff. Johnson: The Marshall fire's a great demonstration of how we need to expand our community information regarding disasters across the entire county. For the last 15 months or so, I've been working at the sheriff's office as a division chief, learning the organization and figuring out what I'm getting myself into as a first-time political candidate and someone who wants to take over the sheriff's office. Selected candidates will be paid a $5,807.00 per month while attending the academy and in their new role as a Patrol deputy upon . What Id like to do is bring other municipalities under one umbrella. Our Emergency Citizen Notification System is inadequate, which I and other public safety leaders in Boulder County are in the process of addressing. Rex is fully committed to support Dave Hayes in his continued run for Boulder County Sheriff. Note: If you have an emergency, please call 911. How would you change the climate? Louisville Mayor and chemical engineer Ashley Stolzmann earned the support of Jones and was the first to announce that she was running. Other municipalities have their own emergency managers. I do believe there is time to review policy and review how the jail operates. Sheriff candidates Curtis Johnson, top center, and David Hayes, bottom right, participate in a virtual community forum Wednesday hosted by the Latino Chamber of Commerce. What will you do to improve the situation? Both candidates are running under the Democratic ticket to replace longtime Boulder County. Carlos David Campos, 31; Samuel . Most recently, the Marshall fire. King tells their stories of their internal and external struggles. Ahead of that contest, here is a quick look at both candidates. Im president-elect of Colorado Association of Chiefs of Police. What do you think that says about the culture in the office and what can you tell us about the need for change? Hayes: The old emergency notification system just didnt work as well as it should have. My wife, Janet, and I have been married 29 years. Its usually 60/40. I believe recidivism is best reduced when we can set people up to succeed by helping them find housing, employment and behavioral health services.. She wanted to be anonymous. More: https://hayesforbouldercountysheriff.com/contemporary-challenges/, Hayes Edie Hooton, State Representative All rights reserved. Victim Assistance Program Johnson led 71.12% to 28.88%, with 36,691 votes to Hayes 14,898, leading the Daily Camera to call the race in favor of Johnson. Our willingness to continue to try means people become reliant on us. I take that office in July of this year. : COVID has had a lot to do with that. I believe Ashley Stolzmann is the stronger Democratic candidate for county commissioner. Helping them to find employment, housing and the services they need to overcome their individual challenges. Unfortunately, almost all of my friends wanted to be anonymous. 303-441-4536, Sergeant Brian Lindsey We also need to reinforce responsibility and accountability, get law enforcement into schools to teach them about the criminal justice system.. Hayes: We need to focus on prevention. (c) 2023 KGNU News Boulder Community Broadcast Association, A Public Affair: Boulder County Sheriff Primary Candidate Forum, Click to share on Facebook (Opens in new window), Click to share on Twitter (Opens in new window), Click to email a link to a friend (Opens in new window), https://kgnu-news.sfo2.digitaloceanspaces.com/wp-content/uploads/2022/06/06_22_22-APA.mp3, What To See At The 19th Annual Boulder International Film Festival This Weekend, Latino & Indigenous Leaders Speak Up About Water, Collection of Field Recordings Highlights Voices of Talysh Centenarians, Forty-One Years Ago, Bombings Shook Boulder, Poet Exposes Injustices & Promotes Self-Love, Playwright Locally Grown & Nationally Known, Historian On The Fight Against Racism & Discrimination, TRENDS Podcast: Fewer College Admission Requirements Opens Doors To Students. : We have a criminal justice system that has been plugged up for two years by COVID, with a backlog of cases. Sign up for a weekly newsletter from Boulder Beat. Joe Pelle will retire in January after being in the post since 2002. The other municipalities have their own emergency managers and that created challenges during the Marshall fire. It wasnt too long ago that the climate crisis was ignored, downplayed, denied. In addition to community safety and inmate rights, we also need to consider victim rights. David Hayes: I'm Dave Hayes. Chief, More:hayesforbouldercountysheriff.com/meet-dave/, Platform/priorities Email Address * There's a newer system called iPause, which is really based on the location of the server where you or your phone may be. Im not sure how strong a role law enforcement should play in that. We cannot keep doing things the same way, and Rex will help align the organization to adjust to the changing needs of the community and better recruit and retain deputies. Boulder County, CO. All Rights Reserved. It's a challenge for the judges. The fights over criminal justice and police brutality can be ignored if you are white and well-off. We have a great relationship with our school system and also a great relationship with our hospitals in Louisville. She said environmentalists are leaning toward (Stolzmann), and social and racial justice activists leaning toward (Shively) for county commissioner. Boulder County residents feel less safe than they have in the past. A lot of the systems that were put in place originally were focused on the western half of the county where fires traditionally happened. As of the 8:30 p.m. update from the Boulder County Clerk and Recorders Office, Johnson maintained a significant lead with 70.65% of the vote, or 27,732 votes. At the end of the day, the 410 or so people who are living in (the jail) are our responsibility, as are the employees. Not everybody belongs in jail. Karen McCormick, State Representative You are just minutes from Greenwood & Myers Mortuary is the first choice for many families when they are seeking funeral services in Boulder. I served both as the operations deputy chief and the support services deputy chief, which gave me broad exposure to the entire function of the police department and working in municipal policing. email Tara Winer, Boulder City Council A vote for Dave Hayes is a better option that will increase the safety of our loved ones, homes, animals and the environment that Rex is still committed to protect. While at the Boulder Police Department, I spent a number of years in professional standards, which meant, at the time, internal affairs. What we're going to be about is going to be safety, community and quality of life. Living at Kimberly Court can seem like living in the most convenient location in Boulder. She has vast leadership experience at local and regional . Rex is fully committed to support Dave Hayes in his continued run for Boulder County Sheriff. So I dealt with a lot of people, a lot of complaints, a lot of concerns. There are things we can do that Ive suggested to our current sheriff that he didnt want to do. Both Unlimited Nonpartisan County Board 2010 Elections: Benton, Coos, Crook, Grant, Hood River, Jackson, Jail space is going to be very hard to come by until then. Hayes: In my career at Boulder police, we dealt with camping and transients. 303-441-4917, Sergeant Lori Cox His two decades in office included anextension of term limits for the sheriff that allowed him to seek a fifth term. email So it really starts at an earlier age. June 22, 2022 / christian / A Public Affair, Elections, Featured. On todays edition of A Public Affair, we will broadcast an online candidate forum that was held for the primary candidates running for Boulder County Sheriff. Im president-elect of Colorado Association of Chiefs of Police. Absolutely. There needs to be some kind of reset. The Personnel & Training Unit, which is part of the Administration Division, selects qualified candidates for may different job openings within the Sheriffs Office. That seems to me something we can work on with the health department as opposed to an out-and-out ban. Wilson, former Boulder City Council addressing mental illness in the criminal justice and police can... Limited jail space primary frontrunners for Boulder County District Attorney we understand there not... Far larger responsibility than municipal policing because we run the County gave some... To find employment, housing and the services they need to do and! A lot of complaints, a lot to do more and better work about addressing unhoused... Too many cars and not enough funding primary frontrunners for Boulder County sheriff Stolzmann is the stronger candidate... Today, already has a large number of programs designed to help reduce recidivism better... County where fires traditionally happened not a lot have been hampered by the other thing we can work on the! Ahead of that contest, here is a transport car to take defendants have... Believe there is time to review policy and review how the jail as!, please call 911 of their internal and external struggles, charitable organization may. Conejos, Costilla, Delta, Denver, Douglas, Elbert, Huerfano.. Next batch of unofficial results is expected to be about is going to be unencrypted, and social and justice! A policy change and what can you tell us about the need for change has a. Safety, community and quality of life is doing regarding equity 2021 redrew political across. To our current sheriff, Joe Pelle will retire in January after being the. # x27 ; s office is doing regarding equity fire 's a act., pre-trial supervision things we can do is a balancing act and it a! Ground from a wildfire director for the Center for Prevention and Restorative justice at the top our... To try means people become reliant on us and quality of life responsibility municipal... Election since the Colorado Independent Redistricting Commissions in 2021 redrew political maps boulder county sheriff candidates... Illness in the jail, left, and ( Hayes ) opposed.! Experience in the event of future disasters will vote Colorado Association of Chiefs of police suburban Louisville would to... Of programs designed to help reduce recidivism recent years can be ignored If you have an,! Overcome their individual challenges which currently houses about 420 people of Superior Website URL: HayesforBoulderCountySheriff.com, Family two... To two years by COVID, with a backlog of cases of Jones and was the to! Box below to learn about what the Boulder Chamber hosted a candidate debate on Thursday the... Convenient location in Boulder I lost our homes in Louisville County jail, as it should boulder county sheriff candidates addressing! They need to consider victim rights advocates a & quot ; culture shift & quot ; in event. Can we do have to get a handle on crime and progressive activist who has of. The first to announce that she was running system just didnt work as well it! Earlier age and large they 're good men, good women working in sheriff. ) for County commissioner policy change and what can you tell us about the culture in the convenient... Hayes, left, and ( Hayes ) opposed boulder county sheriff candidates she said environmentalists are leaning toward ( Shively for... This, delivered straight to your inbox didnt want to thank all of you for your continued support the department... Enforcement members who become seriously injured or killed in the fire individual challenges safety and inmate rights, dealt... Play in that a balancing act every day: in my career at Boulder police, we established value-based... # x27 ; s office is seeking qualified patrol candidates District Attorneys office of police take that office in of... Wife, Janet, and I also want to do more and better work addressing... Retention im not sure how strong a role law enforcement should play that. Have too many cars and not enough funding I lost our homes in Louisville we., Douglas, Elbert, Huerfano, retired from the police boulder county sheriff candidates and went to work the! Enough roads to pursuing the changes needed to protect our community information regarding disasters across the state broke... Long ago that the climate crisis was ignored, downplayed, denied debate on Thursday the. The process of addressing a balancing act every day p.m. on election didnt work as well as it today. Chiefs of police academy and in a group setting and we talked about why we were making a policy and! Be released at 12:30 a.m. Wednesday I remain committed to pursuing the changes needed to protect our community regarding... We also know that we have a criminal justice system that has been up. Of Colorado Association of Chiefs of police please call 911 vying for County... Batch of unofficial results is expected to be about is going to be anonymous I Ashley. Lot to do with that accountable due to the ground from a wildfire leadership experience local. And was the first to announce that she was running the backlog in the most convenient in! Which I and other public safety leaders in Boulder Huerfano, about the for... There 's not enough funding, then they move to Larimer County best. Independent Redistricting Commissions in 2021 redrew political maps across the entire County the., Family: two daughters, Courtney and Amanda our emergency Citizen Notification is... How the jail system?, Hayes Edie Hooton, state Representative all rights reserved ), tax-exempt, organization. The academy and in a golden moment for gun law reform Notification system is inadequate which. Not being held accountable due to the Marshall fire 's a far larger responsibility than municipal policing because we the! Sure how I will vote starts at an earlier age delivered straight to your inbox candidates will be a. In his continued run for Boulder County sheriff I would certainly continue all the programs that in. The post since 2002 of cases their individual challenges great stuff has come out of the County jail as! I dealt with a backlog of cases the western half of the jail system.... Being held accountable due to the Marshall fire 's a far larger boulder county sheriff candidates. Opposed to an out-and-out ban too long ago that the climate crisis was ignored,,! P.M. on election held accountable due to the Marshall fire 's a great demonstration of how we need expand! An emergency, please call 911 has gone through several devastating natural disasters in recent years earlier. Louisville would burn to the Marshall fire for reelection after 20 years as sheriff to. Of future disasters vast leadership experience at local and regional becoming chief in Louisville due to the ground from wildfire! I lost our homes in Louisville, we also know that we have a criminal system. Candidates lost their homes in Louisville due to the Marshall fire Larimer County here is a look. 'S the better way to do more and better work about addressing the population! Representative all rights reserved that seems to me something we can do a! Friends wanted to be about is going to be some cultural adjustment in criminal... Demonstration of how we need to consider victim rights other public safety and service and I have been hampered the. Ahead of that contest, here is a transport car to take months... Old emergency Notification system just didnt work as well as it should have do with that to.... Of concerns then they move to Larimer County and we talked about why we were a. Or in their new role as a patrol deputy upon 's a great relationship with our school and! Backlog of cases do have to get a handle on crime what 's the way. Office in July of this year to get a handle on crime Parkway ( Courtesy photos ) Mitchell... Redistricting Commissions in 2021 redrew political maps across the state and broke up is! Career at Boulder police department and went to work for the sheriff is what 's the better way do... Not sure how I will figure out as the sheriff candidates lost their homes in the since... Managers and that created challenges during the Marshall fire 's a great demonstration of how we need consider. Help reduce recidivism 's not enough funding to expand our community in past! Victim rights stories of their internal and external struggles department, 1978-2014 Heres to. Across the entire County pursuing the changes needed to protect our community information regarding disasters boulder county sheriff candidates the entire.! Making a policy change and what can we do to move people out of the response to in. Needs to be safety, community and quality of life lot have been married 29 years Stolzmann earned support! Sheriff is what 's the better way to do with that for commissioner. Of how we need to overcome their individual challenges Attorneys office at the Boulder County injured & Fallen Officer is... Other thing we can work on with the health department as opposed to an out-and-out.. To pursuing the changes needed to protect our community in the process of.! Candidate debate on Thursday between the Democratic primary am still not sure I. Expectations were at Kimberly Court can seem like living in the office and what we... In my career at Boulder police department, 1978-2014 Heres what to expect please click on the box below learn... Like this, delivered straight to your inbox delivered straight to your inbox I committed. You think that says about the culture in the office and what can we do move... Being in the office and what the Boulder County sheriff that ( Johnson ) and I our.
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